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Interview with Michael Harris, Belfast, 2008 09 26, page 3 ibth - About the recording of these tracks again, the way i think it's coming across, is that there are mainly two people writing songs in there.. that would be Aaron and Mike. So, do you see any striking differences between what would make a "Mike song" and an "Aaron song" ? harris - Oh my god, they are entirely different things ! ibth - ..and does that make any difference recording them ? harris - Yeah, it does. Aaron songs are a lot more rough in the sense that they're.. Well, to me they both come across as very different. First off, i feel like.. Oh god, i don't want to speak for them, but i know that Mike's intention for recording is to record pop songs, in the.. maybe.. older sense of the pop song. The Beatles sense of the pop song, or something like that.. the almost folky, but still rock side. I think that with Aaron there's this tendency for him to write rock songs, you know, and so his songs come across like that to me. ibth - So it's a raw versus polished ? Some sort of visceral versus brain ? Constructed versus ..? harris - You know it's interesting you bring it up too, cause i've been thinking of it a lot. A song like "The Mute", on recording, or a song like "Those Poor Devils", that are Mike's songs, feel like they have a lot of space on them and they're really barren in certain areas, as they draw you ear to a certain sound. And Aaron's are more forceful, and maybe they make you pay attention to a certain thing. Maybe that's a good way of putting it, now i'm saying it.. ibth - I think about Mike's songs, there's something where you can point out the different segments more.. harris - Oh yes, he does, i think so. I think his sections are really well defined, there's a very definite change between a chorus and a verse. And i think that's the case with Aaron's too, but, i think, maybe they blend more together.. it's not "and here starts this", there's almost this transition between a chorus and a verse.. ibth - With Aaron's songs it always comes across, at least to us, as if you always had these layers.. harris - Oh, yes, absolutely. ibth - And then it's as if one of these layers was being brought up to the surface more than the other, and i was wondering.. how is that working in the recording ? harris - It means more tracks, obviously. A lot of times, there's.. Aaron has his track and then simultaneously on top of it he has a part that kind of enters underneath the other and goes into the next section and the same coming out of the next. And often there's another part even on top of that and then Jeff layers on top of that, again, so there's a density to these songs. Aaron's songs are a lot more dense i think, because often they're a lot heavier. "Mannequin" is probably the only one of Mike's that is really heavy, and still, there's a massive amount of space. I think that's the way he writes a song. He leaves a lot of space in the bass line for his vocals when he writes. Whereas when he writes his parts for Aaron's songs.. it's weird, it's like that in reverse. Because he's not singing, he's filling up space with his bass on Aaron's songs.. ibth - ..which then leads to more density.. harris - And i think with Aaron, maybe it's the exact opposite.. maybe it's that, when he writes for somebody else, he leaves more space too. So that would make Mike's songs being a lot more open, and that's why Aaron songs are a lot more dense ? I'm not exactly sure it's the way their minds work.. ibth - There's a gut feeling we had about that..I don't know exactly how to phrase that.. but to me it feels like with Mike it's more like driving through a landscape, with the scenery changing, plains being replaced with mountains, etc., while with Aaron's it's more like sitting by the sea, and watching one wave crashing on top of each other.. harris - Yeah, that's a very good way of putting it, i think, it's very true. And i think they perfectly complement each other. To have both things on the record, that's amazing. I also think that Aaron is really good at writing proper pop songs, as in modern pop songs. "Rebel Hiss" is a good example, it has its verse/chorus/verse/bridge/chorus, and it builds up the whole time, and songs like that, he's really good at that. He's always struck me as a really good writer in that way too. But he can write a rock song like nobody's business you know. A song like "Smoke And Mirrors", you have to hear that one, wow, it's amazing.. ibth - In weird ways i would have had a strong and, well, obviously wrong, feeling that "Smoke And Mirrors" would be strongly influenced by Mike.. because there's something very angular in the bass.. and also since it's so heavy on rhythm, i was thinking it's more a song of someone from the rhythm section.. harris - Yeah, and that's what i was trying to describe in my poor way, that it could be the other person's influence coming from an outside perspective on the other's song, that actually makes it more the way it is. ibth - There are going to be all these guests, especially on the full length.. When you're recording these people, what are you trying to do ? Do you try to unify their input, to give some sort of a more "streamlined" feel to the album, or do you try to bring out their singularity ? Do you try to push each song in a very specific different direction ? harris - I think i try to do both.. again, it's like i was saying.. i pay a lot of attention to all the instruments, and every time we record something, i pay a lot of attention to what it's doing, but it's the same with the song as the whole. I think that ultimately paying attention from the bottom up leads to a certain feel to a song that it otherwise wouldn't have. And i think.. i think maybe i do both, you know. Also, having a song being that'd be really heavy but also moody running into just a moody song.. or.. i don't know exactly, cause we don't know the order of the record yet.. but i think maybe having just a third person like me in there all the time.. With Jeff and Aaron and Mike, two of them may agree, and one of them may disagree, and then i voice my opinion, and it's like "oh no, we're going this way" and "no, now maybe we're going this way." So it smoothens out a little i hope, having that other pair of ears to guide things in another direction. And i didn't explain that before, but a lot of the record was done prior to Jeff joining, in a sense. He was there the whole time, but he wasn't playing guitar yet, Evan was playing guitar, so.. and the songs were already written, and so the fact i was that third pair of ears, i think, really changed a whole lot. Because Evan wasn't always there, and even though Jeff was, he wasn't having the same kind of influence that he has now. But that's another thing.. Jeff coming into the band and bringing his influence has entirely changed their sound to me. Even if he's playing parts that Aaron wrote. ibth - In what ways would you say is Jeff different as a guitarist from Aaron ? harris - Jeff has got a much clearer tone.. you can hear the note's attack, you can hear the note's sustain, and you can hear its decay. Most of the time, Aaron's tone is not like that, the attack and sustain are one thing. They're just.. the note happens and it keeps going. ibth - So in a way that's the next complementary setup after Aaron plus Mike in the songwriting.. it's Aaron plus Jeff in the guitar playing ? harris - Exactly, there is a kind of that dynamic between the clarity of what Jeff is playing, and the kind of jagged, angular, sound that Aaron brings to it. I think those complement each other enormously. ibth - Was there any of the guests on the record, of the drummers, that was especially hard to record ? harris - Yeah, ouchhh ! ibth - I remember you mentioned at some point that you've never seen anyone pounding the drums hearder than Troy ? harris - Troy beats out both Dave Grohl and Joey (Castillo) for how hard he hits the drums and i don't care what anybody says. I know, because you see the levels, it's just louder. He litterally destroys the drum kit. And you can hear it live, you've noticed it's almost hard hearing the instruments over him sometimes. A good example is in the recording studio and the space where they're practicing. We've got a PA set up, and i'm feeding everything through the PA except for his drums just because that's how loud it is. And i have to, because even if they dime their amps, you can't hear it over the drums, and same with the vocals. ibth - So is he the guy who was the hardest to record in there ? harris - Well, honestly, i haven't really recorded Troy, because as for "Pioneers", and "L.A.", Aaron did those before i met him, so those i don't know, and i think that probably the first one i'm going to record with Troy is "I Don't Have An Excuse.." ibth - So who's the hardest so far ? or the trickiest ? harris - Ultimately, if you have a good set of outboard gear, it's really not that hard to record anybody, because you can limit the shit out of anything, and nothing ever peaks.. but the hardest to get the tone, the hardest to get the drums to sound the way i wanted it to.. who was it ? Dave Grohl ? maybe because of my expectations, i don't really know. I mean the drums sound awesome, but it's that thing in my head that says "it should be this way" and then if it's not, i'm dissatisfied, so.. Not to say i'm dissatisfied, i'm actually thrilled. ibth - Do you find yourself in a setup where they would be a sound you'd have in your mind, you or the guys for that matter, and you'd want to make it happen in reality, and it just wouldn't work ? harris - All the time, everyday. You always fall short of where you want to go, almost always. There are those rare occasions that don't, and they live in your mind for ever, like that tone of Jeff's i was talking about on "Honor Among Thieves." But falling short of what you try to achieve, this happens all the time. Aaron's tone is probably the hardest tone to record on earth. I've never ever had more difficulty recording guitar in my life than with him. Because he's so demanding as to what comes out of the amp, and because he wants his sound coming out of the amp.. So i have no choice, i have no leeway with what happens on the amp side, i only can get it to work from my side. It's almost like there's a line, and he can go up to that line, and he can go over that line, but i can only work from that line back, in a way. And sometimes we've gotten very creative on certain sounds in matters of guitar setup. But ultimately, he's the hardest to record, and probably the shortfallings are always the most happened thing. "I want to hear more of that thing but i can't.." you know. But the thing is, that when it goes off to mixing, and it comes back, it's fixed. It's why mixing exists. ibth - So, you're one side of the amplifier, standing there with your mikes, more or less having an active influence, but being on this somewhat passively receiving end.. is it creatively satisfying to be recording ? harris - Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Because.. And that's the unknown and untalked.. maybe not unknown, but untalked about side of recording in the general public's eye.. I think a lot of people's impression of music is that either it's all done live and it just happens.. or maybe they don't even have an impression of what it is exactly, and assume it kind of appears out of nowhere, where everybody's playing live or something like that. But ultimately, it's an incredibly difficult process, and there has to be an enormous amount of attention paid to it, you know. And so when i'm sitting there with the mike going "i don't know where it sounds the best".. I'm the last person to say "that sounds good" or "that sounds bad", and i'm rattling my brain, that's all. Because then what you guys hear and what everybody who buys the record hears, is where i've put that mike, and that's what Aaron's tone is represented by. It's the whole thing "don't kill the messenger".. You know, when you have someone go tell somebody else something and they're like "oh i don't like that, gahh !" and they, you know, stab him or something. Anyway, i have to represent them, in that sense. ibth - With you being a musician yourself, doesn't it itch in your fingers, to.. harris - Yes, because a lot of time someone's made to play something.. like Jeff has to play something that Aaron's written, and he has the tone, and he has the amp settings and everything down, and it takes him a while to learn it.. Whereas, being trained, i know how to play guitar really well, same with the piano, so it's like.. give me guitar, here i am. Honestly, Jeff is a much much better guitarist, in regards to feel, and so i wouldn't have it any other way but sit there for 45 minutes while he learns the part perfectly and then plays it, you know – whereas i could pick it up and play it, but it wouldn't be the same. ibth - In a way in the live setup it's the same.. you're neither one of the musicians on stage nor are you the people enjoying the gig while standing in the pit, but always set aside in some sort of a threshold.. it's a very liminal position.. harris - It is, and it's i think really difficult sometimes. ibth - Is it frustrating ? Are there days when you'd wish you were on stage ? harris - I'm never.. Again, i'm a really modest person, so i never want to be on stage or anything like that.. i really don't care, cause i've played music, i had a band when i was in college too, i played with them all the time, and it was great fun. But i really don't like to be standing there and have people looking at me and not knowing what to do with myself.  ibth - And the other way round.. are there days where you'd just wish to be dumping the mixing board behind yourself and be there in the audience ? harris - Always. ibth - Always ? Sweet. Must be really frustrating then !? harris - No, not always.. for example tonight was a mess of a soundcheck. One of the monitors was blown, the tweeter was only intermittently sending signal, Mike couldn't hear himself at all, i went through the chain with the soundman and we found no problem. Eventually i was like: "why don't we do this.. why don't we go to the two monitors, flip their patches, and see if it still happens with that monitor ?", and of course it did. And i was like "do you have another monitor, let's get it up here" and he got a FOH speaker that he had from a while back and we used that as a monitor and it worked perfectly. But up until that point, i was almost "i don't want to be here", i want to crawl onto that bench over there and go to sleep, cause i only had four hours of sleep.. Or for example, a great example of just wanting to listen to the music, was in Manchester, cause they were just going crazy.. And the soundboard was very very very far to the back.. And i got it sounding great to me, and i was like "i don't want to be back here, i want to watch." You've seen me with Les Gars, i want to be up there, having a good time. And you can have a good time back there but i see mixing engineers all the time, live mixing engineers, and they're jamming out on the faders and shit, and it's stupid. You can't fully enjoy music if you're constantly changing it. ibth - Do you push the faders a lot ? harris - I do.. and i noticed this today. I was standing there, and i was listening to Les Gars, and i saw the sound guy pushing the faders all the time, and i just couldn't hear any difference. Maybe i don't have as good of an ear as i'd like to. But i really couldn't hear what he was doing and that gives me a little help, because i know that when i do something to help the sound.. ibth - So, what you do.. is it about very basic stuff, like equalizing or changing the balance in regard to how the room is full.. or is it about putting more stress on this instrument, or part, or vocal.. what do you do it for ? harris - Today was a great example, because it could be considered a nightmare in regard to the sound. Because everything that came out of the PA, that had anything to do with real top end or real low end, kind of just distorted. So i didn't have much leeway, so i thought to myself "i'll just work with that and make everything sound the best it can in regard to the distorting PA." So i just pushed up what needed to be emphasized, like Jeff's guitar, that was getting lost entirely.. |
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Jubilee (ju.bi.lee), n. : 1. A rock'n'roll band from L.A., Ca., currently composed of Aaron North (vocals, guitar), Tony Bevilacqua (gutar, vocals), Jenni Tarma (bass), Troy Petrey (drums.)2. Jubilation; rejoicing. 3. A season or an occasion of joyful celebration. 4.a. A specially celebrated anniversary. b. The celebration of such an anniversary. |
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